Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
It was interesting to watch the Reorganizational Meeting of the Oshkosh Common Council earlier today. As most of you know I have no problem being critical of elected officials' decisions if I think they're wrong. But I also make it a practice to give someone praise when I think they're doing it right.
That being said, I must give a high-five to Meredith Scheuerman and Shirley Brabender-Mattox. They were just sworn in today and actually seemed to believe, and practice, the issues they campaigned on.
When it came time to discuss rules, in particular with respect to Citizen Statements, they were each in favor of allowing people to continue speaking their minds. New council member Bryan Bain and newly-sworn in mayor Bill Castle, on the other hand - while they campaigned on having a more open, user-friendly government; greater accessibility; and getting more people involved - expressed a desire to want to have citizen comments restricted in nature and scope. This was disappointing, to say the least, and is not a good way to show the people you are interested in hearing what they have to say. Let's hope this was just opening moment jitters and not a sign of what we can expect during their next two years of council service.
We also need to remember when it comes election time next year, that Paul Esslinger was not in favor of restricting what people say. After all, it is OUR government and Paul has always believed people should have the right to say what's on their mind at council meetings.
Conversely, it should be filed away in your memory bank for future reference that Deputy Mayor Frank Tower wanted to do away with Citizen Statements altogether and Burk Tower wanted to make them a little more restrictive. That's right, the Twin Towers apparently want to keep chipping away at the people's voice, one small vote at a time.
Keep your eyes on these council members, folks, because the rules could be changed at any time, and this is one issue that could very well rear its ugly head again.
- Cheryl Hentz
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, April 20 2005 @ 08:24 AM MDT
I would hope the new Mayor would keep the gavil in hand when citizens become abusive and or obnoxious. Something needs to be done with the handful of citizens who get out of line.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Bill Hentz on Thursday, April 21 2005 @ 09:12 AM MDT
It would appear to some people that our newly elected mayor is already talking from both sides of his mouth. In a article in the Northwestern he made the follow statements. "Residents are aparently, taking advantage of their elected mayor's standing and ear. I'm responding to them, they're asking, how can we get our street repaired? Or how can we get the police to enforce the noise ordinances.... They know they can call me know, and I'm responding." Is his "responding" by now wanting to take some of their voice away at council meetings? I certainly hope that the council does not eliminate citizen statements altogether. I fully agree that there is a group of individuals that repeatably bash council members, use obnoxious and vulgar language. However don't punish them majority of those citizens that abide by the rules and are very civilized. It sort of reminds you of the bad apple in the barrel line about not throwing out the whole barrel. Hopefully, if the council looks at this situation further they will come up with some type of restrictions, such as turning off the microphone on an individual using profanity, rather than turning off the microphone on the entire rest of the city.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, April 22 2005 @ 05:11 PM MDT
Cheryl,
What's wrong with requiring citizen statements at a city council meeting be on a topic that the city council can do something about? Isn't that already the rule? It's not an open mic night to talk about anything under the sun!
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: admin on Friday, April 22 2005 @ 08:35 PM MDT
I guess I don't understand what your point is.
- Cheryl Hentz
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: admin on Saturday, April 23 2005 @ 10:13 AM MDT
I guess I still don't understand what your point is, but I never said a citizen's statement should not be on point. But the fact is, some of our councilors wanted to remove statements altogether, while others wanted to limit them to quarterly "appearances," etc.
This is the wrong attitude to send to people who are technically your employers, especially when some of these same people have just said during their political campaigns that they wanted a more open government and greater citizen participation.
- Cheryl Hentz
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, April 25 2005 @ 08:34 AM MDT
I hate to say it, because frankly I think the guy doesn't have a clue 99% of the time, but Stew Reickman's idea of simply not televising the public statement portion isn't a bad one. While the right to address a governing body directly is a little murky in terms of being a God-given American right, there is certainly no right to have your statments (nonsensical rantings, in some cases) televised. This would cut down on the grandstanding and time wasting, as well as keep a very citizen friendly feature of our city government in place.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, April 25 2005 @ 12:39 PM MDT
Oh for God sake, get over it all ready, the City Council members like Castle, Bain and the 2 Towers have never been interested in hearing from you people. They already know whats good for you and this city, and have never once pretended to give a damn what you say. You got the kind of government you voted for!!
I find it laughable that there are folks on this blog, that feel that the citizens comments shouldn't be televised due to grandstanding and profanity? Please have you watch main stream T.V lately?
If the people that are elected don't have the time nor the interest to hear (relavent or not) what the citizens have to say about our community (good bad or whatever) then why run? Why because as I have always maintaned it really is about power, who has it, who keeps it and how it can be used for professional benefits to those individuals.
The newspaper in this city is a royal joke, they speak in one breathe that citizens are entitled to full disclosure in written annoucments, yet Stew Rieckman congratulates the jerks on the council for making the move to shut down citizens statements.
This guy has been in the rabbitt hole too long himself. Stew you've once again shown us that you are nothing but a true coporate whore, and freedoms only apply if you decide to justify!
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, April 26 2005 @ 10:55 AM MDT
What on earth was all that about? No one said anything about eliminating citizen statements in the post you are responding to, simply taking them off television. Last time I checked, the right to have obnoxious statements televised was not part of the first amendment.
I support citizen statements, but only when they are constructive and are in the best interest of the city. I agree that taking citizen statements off of televsion would cut down on those who feel they have to perform for an audience, rather than those who sincerely wish to have their voice heard directly by the council on a particular issue. This wouldn't stop anyone from directly addressing a governing body, it would simply get rid of those who are there for the wrong reasons.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, April 26 2005 @ 12:43 PM MDT
These people are not there to get their comments heard on television. Some have done the same thing at meetings even whent hey are not televised. People who agree with Stew "Reich"man simply are missing the boat, as "Reich"man usually does.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, April 26 2005 @ 04:12 PM MDT
I think your emphasis of the phrase "reich" is in absolute poor taste. You and Mr. Esslinger (for bringing it up on the Eye on Oshkosh television program) should all be ashamed. I find no humor in Nazi references! NONE!! Ms. Hentz and Mr. Palmeri should also be ashamed for not confronting Mr. Esslinger on TV.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, April 26 2005 @ 04:28 PM MDT
Funny how no one rushed to Mr. Esslinger's defense when Jef Hall and the newspaper were trying to make him out to be a racist and sexist. Nor was anyone concerned about a story about Mr. Esslinger in which many statements fabricated and unsubtantiated. Yet here you are condemning him. Doesn't that just beat all. Besides, it's just good natured humor and there is nothing deeper to be taken from it. Please lighten up. If Mr. Riechman is going to dish it out he will have to be able to take it.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, April 27 2005 @ 07:56 AM MDT
To be honest, I don't know who the guy was last night who even made the statement at the council meeting, but his quote (which I may butcher) encapsulates this perfectly:
"Great men discuss ideas, average men discuss events and lesser men discuss people."
I hate to say it, but for all the potential in this website for us to be great men (and women) who discuss ideas, I hear nothing but attacking the person behind the idea. Hentz's attacks on Castle, The Towers and Bain, this previous poster's attacks on Reickman and even previous to that out of nowhere an attack on Esslinger. Not their ideas, mind you, but the people behind them. Needless to say, for anyone looking to actually engage in a healthy discussion of ideas, to have it continuously degenerate into personal attacks is quite disheartening.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, April 27 2005 @ 12:25 PM MDT
They are not attacks on these officials' characters. They are criticisms of their job performance. Big difference.
While we're on the subject of people being critical and attacking in nature, what was the deal with Heidi Strand at last night's council meeting? She made assassinating remarks about Paul Esslinger, yet didn't have her own facts straight in some cases. Good thing Esslinger took her down a few pegs. She was also complaining about things being a waste of her tax dollars but yet Esslinger was actually trying to do something to save some of the taxpayers some money and she had a problem with it. These so-called progressive liberals are unbelievable. They'll say anything to deflect the real issues.
The real probem isn't even that she disagreed with Esslinger. It's how she did it. The snotty tone in her voice and the snugness on her face were disgusting. Maybe some citizens should tell the school board the district is wasting our money hiring her to do work for them. But until such time let's hope she is more successful in her venture with the school district than she was in other things she has tried over the years. On the other side of the coin it's easy to be successful when you suck up to the right people and kiss the right butts. Trouble is there's so many to kiss and not enough hours in the day.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, April 27 2005 @ 12:41 PM MDT
Great. More personal criticism. Just what we all need.
"These so-called progressive liberals are unbelievable."
"The snotty tone in her voice and the snugness on her face were disgusting."
"...let's hope she is more successful in her venture with the school district than she was in other things she has tried over the years."
"It's easy to be successful when you suck up to the right people and kiss the right butts."
Come on.
The discussion here should be on the issues: What was Esslinger's proposal? What are the short and long term benefits/consequences of acting/not acting on Mr. Esslinger's idea? What is the empirical evidence to back up each of these positions? I guess though, if you would prefer to just say snide things about someone its alot asier than getting into any of those "fact" type things, huh?
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, April 27 2005 @ 12:47 PM MDT
Mr. Esslinger presented the city's own research to support his request. As for Ms. Strand's look or tone, they speak for themselves.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, April 27 2005 @ 02:01 PM MDT
While I do not agree with Mr. Esslinger's idea, I thought the attitude and tone of Ms Strands remarks were uncalled for and very unprofessional. I wonder what she would think if someone would single out one of her friends on the council and launch a personal attack against them?
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, April 27 2005 @ 02:02 PM MDT
If her tone and look "speak for themselves", then there is no legitimate reason for us to be discussing them.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, April 28 2005 @ 04:54 AM MDT
I do not believe this idea was Mr. Rickman's. The suggestion was in the material that a person gave to the council several weeks ago. I do not remember her name, but was the one that spoke to the issue of the citizens statements and had suggestions on how they could be handled. If you read the article in the paper I think you will see this.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, April 28 2005 @ 02:07 PM MDT
The woman at the council meeting a month or so ago had dufferent suggestions on what could be done. Rieckman keyed in on that particular one. But no matter where the idea came from the end result is that Rieckman put forth the one main idea. If he truly wants to be fair and unbiased as he always claims his paper is then he should have talked about the pros and cons of each idea.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, April 28 2005 @ 02:30 PM MDT
Who on earth cares where the idea came from and why are people still talking about the source? What a collossal waste of time this is to continuously discuss the person behind the idea as opposed to the idea! Anyone have any constructive suggestions to add to the dicsussion of this issue?
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, April 28 2005 @ 03:33 PM MDT
Here's a thought on the idea. It stinks. If people really think that turning off the cameras for citizen statements is going to stop some of the comments the councilors are hearing they are as wrong as they can.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, April 29 2005 @ 04:43 AM MDT
Well well,l I didn't see any ideas in what you just posted! Don't go after us about it doesn't matter this or that......."what a waste of time" ... does anyone have a suggestions etc .... and then say nothing "constructive" yourself!
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, April 29 2005 @ 07:38 AM MDT
I hate to say this, and the anonymity makes it a bit tougher, but my original post was the thought that perhaps this would be a decent comprimise. By turning off the cameras during citizen statements, we succeed in keeping the voice of our citizens to directly address the council but weed out anyone who is there for the wrong reasons. While this might not discourage any of the true hard core, I think it is a step in the right direction that makes sense for the time being. I would hate to see them eliminated, but really, what good does it do for the city to listen to some of the nonsense that gets thrown out during public statements? There are two very reasonable sides to this issue, I just felt like that was a good comprimise.
Discussing the merits of this idea is constructive- discussing the people involved is not.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, April 29 2005 @ 06:18 PM MDT
For the record: Marsha Rossiter presented the common council with documents on conflict resolution and a guide to civil discussion of public issues. Copies are available at the city clerk's office for anyone interested in checking as opposed to speculating.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, April 29 2005 @ 08:55 PM MDT
It really does not matter who presented the comments. What is really being discussed and debated here is whether citizen statements should be done away with; whether cameras should be turned off for citizen statements; or if something else should be done to stop Gordon Douleys and peole like him from being rude and disrespectful to the council members.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Saturday, April 30 2005 @ 03:19 PM MDT
Amen to that!!!!!!!
That being said, I must give a high-five to Meredith Scheuerman and Shirley Brabender-Mattox. They were just sworn in today and actually seemed to believe, and practice, the issues they campaigned on.
When it came time to discuss rules, in particular with respect to Citizen Statements, they were each in favor of allowing people to continue speaking their minds. New council member Bryan Bain and newly-sworn in mayor Bill Castle, on the other hand - while they campaigned on having a more open, user-friendly government; greater accessibility; and getting more people involved - expressed a desire to want to have citizen comments restricted in nature and scope. This was disappointing, to say the least, and is not a good way to show the people you are interested in hearing what they have to say. Let's hope this was just opening moment jitters and not a sign of what we can expect during their next two years of council service.
We also need to remember when it comes election time next year, that Paul Esslinger was not in favor of restricting what people say. After all, it is OUR government and Paul has always believed people should have the right to say what's on their mind at council meetings.
Conversely, it should be filed away in your memory bank for future reference that Deputy Mayor Frank Tower wanted to do away with Citizen Statements altogether and Burk Tower wanted to make them a little more restrictive. That's right, the Twin Towers apparently want to keep chipping away at the people's voice, one small vote at a time.
Keep your eyes on these council members, folks, because the rules could be changed at any time, and this is one issue that could very well rear its ugly head again.
- Cheryl Hentz
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, April 20 2005 @ 08:24 AM MDT
I would hope the new Mayor would keep the gavil in hand when citizens become abusive and or obnoxious. Something needs to be done with the handful of citizens who get out of line.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Bill Hentz on Thursday, April 21 2005 @ 09:12 AM MDT
It would appear to some people that our newly elected mayor is already talking from both sides of his mouth. In a article in the Northwestern he made the follow statements. "Residents are aparently, taking advantage of their elected mayor's standing and ear. I'm responding to them, they're asking, how can we get our street repaired? Or how can we get the police to enforce the noise ordinances.... They know they can call me know, and I'm responding." Is his "responding" by now wanting to take some of their voice away at council meetings? I certainly hope that the council does not eliminate citizen statements altogether. I fully agree that there is a group of individuals that repeatably bash council members, use obnoxious and vulgar language. However don't punish them majority of those citizens that abide by the rules and are very civilized. It sort of reminds you of the bad apple in the barrel line about not throwing out the whole barrel. Hopefully, if the council looks at this situation further they will come up with some type of restrictions, such as turning off the microphone on an individual using profanity, rather than turning off the microphone on the entire rest of the city.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, April 22 2005 @ 05:11 PM MDT
Cheryl,
What's wrong with requiring citizen statements at a city council meeting be on a topic that the city council can do something about? Isn't that already the rule? It's not an open mic night to talk about anything under the sun!
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: admin on Friday, April 22 2005 @ 08:35 PM MDT
I guess I don't understand what your point is.
- Cheryl Hentz
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: admin on Saturday, April 23 2005 @ 10:13 AM MDT
I guess I still don't understand what your point is, but I never said a citizen's statement should not be on point. But the fact is, some of our councilors wanted to remove statements altogether, while others wanted to limit them to quarterly "appearances," etc.
This is the wrong attitude to send to people who are technically your employers, especially when some of these same people have just said during their political campaigns that they wanted a more open government and greater citizen participation.
- Cheryl Hentz
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, April 25 2005 @ 08:34 AM MDT
I hate to say it, because frankly I think the guy doesn't have a clue 99% of the time, but Stew Reickman's idea of simply not televising the public statement portion isn't a bad one. While the right to address a governing body directly is a little murky in terms of being a God-given American right, there is certainly no right to have your statments (nonsensical rantings, in some cases) televised. This would cut down on the grandstanding and time wasting, as well as keep a very citizen friendly feature of our city government in place.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, April 25 2005 @ 12:39 PM MDT
Oh for God sake, get over it all ready, the City Council members like Castle, Bain and the 2 Towers have never been interested in hearing from you people. They already know whats good for you and this city, and have never once pretended to give a damn what you say. You got the kind of government you voted for!!
I find it laughable that there are folks on this blog, that feel that the citizens comments shouldn't be televised due to grandstanding and profanity? Please have you watch main stream T.V lately?
If the people that are elected don't have the time nor the interest to hear (relavent or not) what the citizens have to say about our community (good bad or whatever) then why run? Why because as I have always maintaned it really is about power, who has it, who keeps it and how it can be used for professional benefits to those individuals.
The newspaper in this city is a royal joke, they speak in one breathe that citizens are entitled to full disclosure in written annoucments, yet Stew Rieckman congratulates the jerks on the council for making the move to shut down citizens statements.
This guy has been in the rabbitt hole too long himself. Stew you've once again shown us that you are nothing but a true coporate whore, and freedoms only apply if you decide to justify!
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, April 26 2005 @ 10:55 AM MDT
What on earth was all that about? No one said anything about eliminating citizen statements in the post you are responding to, simply taking them off television. Last time I checked, the right to have obnoxious statements televised was not part of the first amendment.
I support citizen statements, but only when they are constructive and are in the best interest of the city. I agree that taking citizen statements off of televsion would cut down on those who feel they have to perform for an audience, rather than those who sincerely wish to have their voice heard directly by the council on a particular issue. This wouldn't stop anyone from directly addressing a governing body, it would simply get rid of those who are there for the wrong reasons.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, April 26 2005 @ 12:43 PM MDT
These people are not there to get their comments heard on television. Some have done the same thing at meetings even whent hey are not televised. People who agree with Stew "Reich"man simply are missing the boat, as "Reich"man usually does.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, April 26 2005 @ 04:12 PM MDT
I think your emphasis of the phrase "reich" is in absolute poor taste. You and Mr. Esslinger (for bringing it up on the Eye on Oshkosh television program) should all be ashamed. I find no humor in Nazi references! NONE!! Ms. Hentz and Mr. Palmeri should also be ashamed for not confronting Mr. Esslinger on TV.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, April 26 2005 @ 04:28 PM MDT
Funny how no one rushed to Mr. Esslinger's defense when Jef Hall and the newspaper were trying to make him out to be a racist and sexist. Nor was anyone concerned about a story about Mr. Esslinger in which many statements fabricated and unsubtantiated. Yet here you are condemning him. Doesn't that just beat all. Besides, it's just good natured humor and there is nothing deeper to be taken from it. Please lighten up. If Mr. Riechman is going to dish it out he will have to be able to take it.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, April 27 2005 @ 07:56 AM MDT
To be honest, I don't know who the guy was last night who even made the statement at the council meeting, but his quote (which I may butcher) encapsulates this perfectly:
"Great men discuss ideas, average men discuss events and lesser men discuss people."
I hate to say it, but for all the potential in this website for us to be great men (and women) who discuss ideas, I hear nothing but attacking the person behind the idea. Hentz's attacks on Castle, The Towers and Bain, this previous poster's attacks on Reickman and even previous to that out of nowhere an attack on Esslinger. Not their ideas, mind you, but the people behind them. Needless to say, for anyone looking to actually engage in a healthy discussion of ideas, to have it continuously degenerate into personal attacks is quite disheartening.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, April 27 2005 @ 12:25 PM MDT
They are not attacks on these officials' characters. They are criticisms of their job performance. Big difference.
While we're on the subject of people being critical and attacking in nature, what was the deal with Heidi Strand at last night's council meeting? She made assassinating remarks about Paul Esslinger, yet didn't have her own facts straight in some cases. Good thing Esslinger took her down a few pegs. She was also complaining about things being a waste of her tax dollars but yet Esslinger was actually trying to do something to save some of the taxpayers some money and she had a problem with it. These so-called progressive liberals are unbelievable. They'll say anything to deflect the real issues.
The real probem isn't even that she disagreed with Esslinger. It's how she did it. The snotty tone in her voice and the snugness on her face were disgusting. Maybe some citizens should tell the school board the district is wasting our money hiring her to do work for them. But until such time let's hope she is more successful in her venture with the school district than she was in other things she has tried over the years. On the other side of the coin it's easy to be successful when you suck up to the right people and kiss the right butts. Trouble is there's so many to kiss and not enough hours in the day.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, April 27 2005 @ 12:41 PM MDT
Great. More personal criticism. Just what we all need.
"These so-called progressive liberals are unbelievable."
"The snotty tone in her voice and the snugness on her face were disgusting."
"...let's hope she is more successful in her venture with the school district than she was in other things she has tried over the years."
"It's easy to be successful when you suck up to the right people and kiss the right butts."
Come on.
The discussion here should be on the issues: What was Esslinger's proposal? What are the short and long term benefits/consequences of acting/not acting on Mr. Esslinger's idea? What is the empirical evidence to back up each of these positions? I guess though, if you would prefer to just say snide things about someone its alot asier than getting into any of those "fact" type things, huh?
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, April 27 2005 @ 12:47 PM MDT
Mr. Esslinger presented the city's own research to support his request. As for Ms. Strand's look or tone, they speak for themselves.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, April 27 2005 @ 02:01 PM MDT
While I do not agree with Mr. Esslinger's idea, I thought the attitude and tone of Ms Strands remarks were uncalled for and very unprofessional. I wonder what she would think if someone would single out one of her friends on the council and launch a personal attack against them?
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, April 27 2005 @ 02:02 PM MDT
If her tone and look "speak for themselves", then there is no legitimate reason for us to be discussing them.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, April 28 2005 @ 04:54 AM MDT
I do not believe this idea was Mr. Rickman's. The suggestion was in the material that a person gave to the council several weeks ago. I do not remember her name, but was the one that spoke to the issue of the citizens statements and had suggestions on how they could be handled. If you read the article in the paper I think you will see this.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, April 28 2005 @ 02:07 PM MDT
The woman at the council meeting a month or so ago had dufferent suggestions on what could be done. Rieckman keyed in on that particular one. But no matter where the idea came from the end result is that Rieckman put forth the one main idea. If he truly wants to be fair and unbiased as he always claims his paper is then he should have talked about the pros and cons of each idea.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, April 28 2005 @ 02:30 PM MDT
Who on earth cares where the idea came from and why are people still talking about the source? What a collossal waste of time this is to continuously discuss the person behind the idea as opposed to the idea! Anyone have any constructive suggestions to add to the dicsussion of this issue?
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, April 28 2005 @ 03:33 PM MDT
Here's a thought on the idea. It stinks. If people really think that turning off the cameras for citizen statements is going to stop some of the comments the councilors are hearing they are as wrong as they can.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, April 29 2005 @ 04:43 AM MDT
Well well,l I didn't see any ideas in what you just posted! Don't go after us about it doesn't matter this or that......."what a waste of time" ... does anyone have a suggestions etc .... and then say nothing "constructive" yourself!
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, April 29 2005 @ 07:38 AM MDT
I hate to say this, and the anonymity makes it a bit tougher, but my original post was the thought that perhaps this would be a decent comprimise. By turning off the cameras during citizen statements, we succeed in keeping the voice of our citizens to directly address the council but weed out anyone who is there for the wrong reasons. While this might not discourage any of the true hard core, I think it is a step in the right direction that makes sense for the time being. I would hate to see them eliminated, but really, what good does it do for the city to listen to some of the nonsense that gets thrown out during public statements? There are two very reasonable sides to this issue, I just felt like that was a good comprimise.
Discussing the merits of this idea is constructive- discussing the people involved is not.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, April 29 2005 @ 06:18 PM MDT
For the record: Marsha Rossiter presented the common council with documents on conflict resolution and a guide to civil discussion of public issues. Copies are available at the city clerk's office for anyone interested in checking as opposed to speculating.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, April 29 2005 @ 08:55 PM MDT
It really does not matter who presented the comments. What is really being discussed and debated here is whether citizen statements should be done away with; whether cameras should be turned off for citizen statements; or if something else should be done to stop Gordon Douleys and peole like him from being rude and disrespectful to the council members.
Kudos to Meredith and Shirley
Authored by: Anonymous on Saturday, April 30 2005 @ 03:19 PM MDT
Amen to that!!!!!!!
posted by Cheryl Hentz at 1:26 PM
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